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  Ele/Demo PvE: Totem of Wrath in 3.2.2 |
09/14/09 02:05:42 PM
Patch 3.2.0a
Strawberry |
I'll start off by stating the obvious.
Elemental is getting buffed this patch. The changes are looking to
be a pretty considerable DPS increase, and it is one that scales.
It's not perfect, but it does at least have the potential to keep
elemental in a state no worse than we've been in since 3.0.8. Not
sure exactly to what extent, and that will only come via more
testing.
So let's put our DPS aside for a moment until we have more
interesting data on that, and talk about something else. I'll keep
this short, because I see it as a very simple issue that has a very
simple fix - even if it does make a world of difference:
Totem of Wrath is the same now as it was when we first hit 80. At
first, ToW was all but required for raids. You NEEDED an Elemental
Shaman, or your raid was missing out on something, and you would
only use an alternative if you had no other choice. Demonic Pact,
however, has improved rougly 300%, and is now outclassing ToW once
some threshold of gear is crossed by the warlock - and is creating
the same situation, only with the warlock occuping the shaman's
previous raid spot.
Both of those situations are problematic, and are the sole
example left in the game of one specific spec being "required" for
an optimal raid group.
I propose something very simple - that the two buffs be made equal
at all levels of content. The specifics are largely unimportant -
as long as they're equal in effectiveness, it should work out the
same way. Doing so means that you can take an Elemental Shaman OR a
Demonology Warlock (or both) to a raid - but you'll never feel like
you're missing out if you're lacking whichever one is currently the
"right" choice for the spell power buff.
[ Post edited by Strawberry
]
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09/15/09 12:57:54 PM
Patch 3.2.0a
Ghostcrawler
<Lead Systems Designer> |
Strawberry makes great posts, as
usual.
We want to solve the discrepancy between ToW and DP before
Cataclysm.
Demonology needs to be brought because it does competitive dps, not
because it has an awesome buff. Or even better, you should want the
Demo lock because the player playing it is someone you want to play
with. Nobody should get brought because they have an awesome buff
but are otherwise a liability. You should be able to get most of
the buffs and debuffs you really need in a number of different raid
configurations, and ideally even taking two players of the exact
same spec won't feel like a mistake. The game should be in
defeating the boss, not assembling the group.
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09/16/09 12:23:48 PM
Patch 3.2.0a
Ghostcrawler
<Lead Systems Designer> |
Q u o t e:
Q u o t e:
Why did gc take a buff elemental totem post and turn it into a buff
demo warlock post? He states the strawberry makes great posts, then
completely ignores the point he was making, besides a 1 line cheap
cop out "Oh, it needs to be fixed sometime".
Because the entire issue is rather interwoven. It is not an easy
fix without repercussions to several other specs.
You see, people that like playing Demo really like that the DP buff
has out scaled ToW because as a class warlocks are thought of as
being a "pure" DPS class. That means that warlocks are always stuck
with the flavor of the month spec that provides max DPS. For once
an alternative spec (not counting those that are used on gimmick
fights) has become viable and many warlocks like having this
option. But the gain of the Demolocks is coming at the expense of
the Elemental Shaman. Its not the easy to fix issue so many seem to
believe it is, or at least its not easy for some that like finally
having options.
I said ToW vs. DP is a problem that we want to fix. We aren't ready
to discuss potential fixes yet so there's not much I can add to
that topic.
We don't think Elemental (or Shadow for that matter) are as low as
a lot of players of those respective specs seem to believe, but
both received small buffs. While it wasn't necessarily our
intention, both of those tweaks happen to be relatively tricky to
theorycraft out, so the jury is still out on what kind of buff they
will provide or if they will be considered "enough."
Some posters then tried to justify Demos's low dps because of their
great buffs, but that isn't the way we actually want the game to
work.
All classes should have buffs. All damage specs should do
competitive dps, with the exception that the four pure classes
should do slightly higher dps. Different versions of the same buff
should not feel wildly different with regard to talent expenditure,
personal dps loss, up time, duration or scaling. We will continue
to work to improve all of those issues. However, in almost all
cases, individual skill, gear and group coordination will have a
larger effect on your performance than anything we can do to buff
your class.
P.S. I feel the need to reinforce that "should not feel wildly
different" does not mean "identical." We generally don't
like things between classes that are identical.
[ Post edited by
Ghostcrawler ]
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09/16/09 12:44:07 PM
Patch 3.2.0a
Ghostcrawler
<Lead Systems Designer> |
Q u o t e:
So are you going to buff Demonology in 3.2.2 or not? Inquiring
Locks wanna know.
Questions like that aren't good ones for me to answer. If we say we
plan on doing it and then don't follow through for some reason or
another, then we have "broken a promise" to the community. If we
had concrete plans that we were ready to talk about, we would. I'll
leave it as we think Demo dps is too low in a raid setting.
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